From: wxc21@psu.edu Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology,alt.support.bruderhof Subject: Re: What is Date: 2 Jul 1997 22:06:13 GMT Organization: Reference.Com Posting Service Lines: 102 Message-ID: <5pejcl$coo$1@orthanc.reference.com> References: <33AB0EBA.795A@worldnet.att.net> <5ohti3$f31@flatland.dimensional.com> <33b5626c.7205610@news.capital.net> <33b07c45.14485804@news.mindspring.com> <5p5g3u$961$1@orthanc.reference.com> <9tauzMdlg0kI092yn@islandnet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: shadowfax.reference.com Originator: panuser@reference.com () > Now, this is *really* confusing. As far as I know, all the Hutterites > *live* in colonies called "Bruderhofs". > > What kind of association are you talking about? The organization which now calls itself "the Bruderhof Communities" was admitted into the Hutterian church in the 1930s. The founder of The Bruderhof communities, Eberhard Arnold, had studied the Anabaptist, particuillarly the Hutterites, and found he had much in common with their early belief's and practices -particullarly community of goods. When he discovered that the Hutterites still existed in North America he visited them and was ordained as a minister, with his little communities in Germany being admitted to the Church. The "Arnoldleut" communities never quite fit into the Hutterites, there were splits and crisi between the "Old Order" Hutterites and these new folks. There was a separation in the 50s, then a re-uniting in the 70s, with another separation occuring recently. The last time they saparated the "Arnoldleut" named themselves "The Society of Brothers". I guess they like the name "Bruderhof" -borrowed of course from the Hutterites, so they decided to charter their separate organization under that name. They call their communes bruderhofs, as do the Hutterites. I suppose they will keep amny other forms of Hutterianism such as the Women's clothing style and the basic organization and eclesiastical titles. > May I ask what your relationship to all this is? Are you a Hutterite > living in a Bruderhof community, a break-away, what? What you're > saying literally doesn't make any sense to me; I can't make head > or tails of it. I was a member of the Bruderhof at the time when they were starting to separate from the Hutterites, and at the time when they were taking a less pacifistic attitude toward their "enemies". I chose to leave rather than go along with this stuff. I sympathize with the Hutterites in many of their concerns, the Bruderhof would be in much better shape if they had just been faithful to their commitments to the Hutterian church rather than setting up their own independent group. But the whole situation is wrapped up in manipulation, power politics and control. I think the Hutterites, being much more committed to living according to the teachings of the New Testament, were a stabelizing influence of the Bruderofers. Now the Bruderhof leadership can do as it wishes with accountability to no one. > Are there other kinds of Hutterites? Are the people living in > the Bruderhofs not Hutterites? Has there been some kind of > schism recently with many of the, what, 60 or so Bruderhofs > taking leave of the Hutterite collective? The seven "Arnoldleut" communities were expelled by the larger part of the Hutterite church, and recently by the remainder. The These communities have disassociated themselves from the Hutterites. > As far as I know, the two are inseperable ideas, like a pond > composed of water. The Hutterites and the "Bruderhof Communities" were more like oil and water. > >I (gladly at the time) joined the Bruderhof with my wife four > >years ago. > > Which one? Catskiill in New York > >Christian pacifists do not sue at law. The Bruderhof (not the > >Hutterites) do of course bring lawsuits and other violent actions > >against their critics. True. Now you're beginning to understand a little of what this is all about. > Hmm; this would make them a cult by my definition, a destructive > and aggressive quasi-religious group. But I still cannot parse > the ideas "Bruderhof" and "Hutterite". I suspect these terms are > to some degree loaded, with different groups claiming rights to > them, much as some freezoners call themselves "Scientologists", > while Scientologists still in the cult structure proper label > them "squirrels", and the freezone "Scientologists" retaliate > with terms like "churchies" to them, and so on. I don't think the Hutterites care what the Bruderhofers calll themselves, they're likely just glad that they don't call themselves Hutterites anymore. Peace, Wayne -- Posted using Reference.COM http://www.reference.com Browse, Search and Post Usenet and Mailing list Archive and Catalog. InReference, Inc. accepts no responsibility for the content of this posting.